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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:22 am 
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VAR annoys me as it should be so simple. Did the ball go out of play, was he offside, how does that take 5 minutes?! With fouls and are they penalties, if you heard the discussion, it would help. In Rugby you do and the contentious decisions are explained. That eradicates lots of confusion. If something cannot be visibly changed in 30/45 seconds, it does not need to be altered. You can get to the right decision so much quicker and with far less issues.

5 Substitutions is okay. But I would change it so it's 2 game-stops only in the second half. If you get injuries in the first half, you should not be penalised when it comes to tactical decisions in the second half. I'd even go further and say subs can only be made (excluding injuries) at HT, 60mins and 75mins. But I know that'll never come in so no point beating that drum.

The rule I would add is no subs after 90mins. And with injury time you have a "last play". The moment they time is up, then it's play until the ball goes out of play. Best thing Rugby has that you can pinch from there.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:48 am 
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I have no problem with changing the laws as they have been changing ever since the game was modified in the 1860's, they just need to spend more time ensuring the changes work, in this case it appears the ground und work has started at youth level and needs to be reviewed and trialled at a higher level and progress from there.
VAR is the most controversial change and it was rushed in at the top level rather than the process being used here.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 8:55 am 
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Alby39 wrote:
It's highly likely at some point in the near future we will see:

*A VAR decision, such as a penalty, taking 3-5 minutes to solve. Game square at 1-1.
* Team goes down to ten men with the blue card.
* Parking the bus because of the disadvantage.
* Game goes back to 11 v 11.
* Another VAR decision.
* 5 subs a side.
* Another VAR decision.
* 20 minutes injury time.

That isn't football.


I can totally see that scenario happening and becoming the norm. But I think part of this would be alleviated by sin bins. Imagine

*A VAR decision, such as a penalty, taking 3-5 minutes to solve. Game square at 1-1.
* Team goes down to ten men with second yellow, one of which is a bit marginal.
* Parking the bus for the rest of the match because of the disadvantage.
* Another VAR decision.
* 5 subs a side.
* Another VAR decision.
* 20 minutes injury time.

Whats worse?


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:02 am 
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Scribble wrote:
With the reference to Rugby, they still only use two cards, yellow for the sin bin with a possible review it could be red and straight red as in football is a sending off.

Football does not need three cards, you make a bad tackle you’re yellow carded, do it again and you’re off, make a reckless challenge it’s a red, to me there is no inbetween, no need for a blue card, orange card or whatever colour of choice, it’s just not needed.

It’s not inconceivable you could have two or three players off in a sin bin at any given time, it’s just ruining the game


Two players off in the sin bin isn't that uncommon in union or league....it CAN add to the excitement in my view. It also cuts the grubby play down ....

I guess in rugby of both codes you can't park the bus in the same way as football ..can only try and slow the ruck down and that doesn't work as most sides just end up giving away penalties

At the moment I'm thinking no to the blue card in football

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:18 am 
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Football needs to do something to get players to accept and respect the referee’s authority. Maybe this could do that.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:33 am 
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Magpie wrote:
Alby39 wrote:
It's highly likely at some point in the near future we will see:

*A VAR decision, such as a penalty, taking 3-5 minutes to solve. Game square at 1-1.
* Team goes down to ten men with the blue card.
* Parking the bus because of the disadvantage.
* Game goes back to 11 v 11.
* Another VAR decision.
* 5 subs a side.
* Another VAR decision.
* 20 minutes injury time.

That isn't football.


I can totally see that scenario happening and becoming the norm. But I think part of this would be alleviated by sin bins. Imagine

*A VAR decision, such as a penalty, taking 3-5 minutes to solve. Game square at 1-1.
* Team goes down to ten men with second yellow, one of which is a bit marginal.
* Parking the bus for the rest of the match because of the disadvantage.
* Another VAR decision.
* 5 subs a side.
* Another VAR decision.
* 20 minutes injury time.

Whats worse?


What's worse? The aforementioned scenario with blue cards 100%.
The whole dynamic of football will change as a result. How to behave when you go down to ten for a brief period. How to drop off for short periods. You'll automatically see sides drop off into low blocks, bus parking, 10 men behind the ball.
It creates another problem for the referee. Subjective decisions seem to be the big thing of discussions with VAR. Clear and obvious ridiculousness. Now with your blue card you'll have referees conclude that X player has purposely brought down Y player through on goal when actually, he didn't intend to bring Y player down as a 'tactical foul' - it had been forced by Y player to gain the ten minute advantage. Another thing to beat referees over.
Could have another 5 minute VAR decision to conclude whether X player intended to tactically foul Y player, it will be contentious and another post match manager rambling once Y Player's team go down to 10 for 10 mins, concede a goal and that's another needless situation..

Does it happen already? Yes. But being on a yellow is already a disadvantage - prevents a tackle you'd want to make. Prevents a sense of freedom the booked player would otherwise play with but, at least he's there - until he gets booked again. If he gets booked again he goes and he goes for good. I can't think of any scenario whatsoever that justifies a sin bin. If a tackle is on the edge of red and yellow "often know as an orange card) it generally becomes subjective and more often than not is given as a yellow to prevent losing a man and making the game worse.
If you start introducing blue cards for those tackles, you may as well send him off. If its worse than yellow then it is red.

Collectively throughout the game you're gonna get potentially 3 blue cards. That's half an hour in 90 mins where you'll have defensive sit back football. The way it stands at the minute, red cards are still rare enough that it doesn't disrupt a game frequently enough. Once a referee is in a position where he doesn't need to 'send him off ' you'll see no doubt several moments where tactics are forcefully changed by losing players for periods. The flow of the game plans change. Continuously.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 9:37 am 
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dons50 wrote:
Football needs to do something to get players to accept and respect the referee’s authority. Maybe this could do that.


Of course you're for it. IFAB could introduce a law where the referees could stop the game whenever they feel tired and you'd think it'd a good idea.

SteelbackDon wrote:
And with injury time you have a "last play". The moment they time is up, then it's play until the ball goes out of play. Best thing Rugby has that you can pinch from there.


You and I both know as soon as that 90 minute mark is hit, the winning side just launches it out of whichever perimeter is nearest. No injury time equalisers any more. Not for me.

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 10:18 am 
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Alby39 wrote:
dons50 wrote:

You and I both know as soon as that 90 minute mark is hit, the winning side just launches it out of whichever perimeter is nearest. No injury time equalisers any more. Not for me.


But which is it you want? you dont want the longer periods of 'injury' time it seems but also dont want the game to end at normal time either.

The term injury time just isnt helpful. There is some injury time in most matches but even then the majority are magic sponge injuries that dont require a stoppage really, then its added time for subs and just plain old time wasting by both teams who then inevitably complain bitterly that there should have been more or less depending on the circumstances.


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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 10:29 am 
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To answer it very simply, the minimum amount of injury time required. As has been the case for a very very long time. They tried to mess with it at the start of the season and we had 14 minutes extra in some cases.
It has generally phased back to 'normal' but here and there you see pointless 9's and 10's still..
That's understandable when there's been a lengthy injury or such, what isn't is when the refs stop the clock for throw ins, free kicks, and all the other silly shit that lead to 14/15 mins of added time. Blue cards will add to that nonsense

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PostPosted: Fri Feb 09, 2024 10:39 am 
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Alby39 wrote:
To answer it very simply, the minimum amount of injury time required. As has been the case for a very very long time. They tried to mess with it at the start of the season and we had 14 minutes extra in some cases.
It has generally phased back to 'normal' but here and there you see pointless 9's and 10's still..
That's understandable when there's been a lengthy injury or such, what isn't is when the refs stop the clock for throw ins, free kicks, and all the other silly shit that lead to 14/15 mins of added time. Blue cards will add to that nonsense


Maybe, maybe not. How long does your average red take? How long do freekicks take to get set up and penalties? What about the pretendy injuries, do you include them? The application of time is subjective between one match and another and one ref and another. jeez, sometimes I think the atmosphere around a match can affect how long a ref wants to stay out there!

I have no idea if blue cards will work out or not and I absolutely dont think it should be an immediate introduction into the pro leagues but I do think trialling it in the National Leagues has merit.

if that is a success, however one might measure that I dont know but assume it is measurable then perhaps move it into the EFL. Aligning it with VAR would be very tricky I understand so it might never work in conjunction with VAR or at all for that matter but nobody can be definitive either way at the moment.


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