THE CONCRETE ROUNDABOUT (TCR)

I'm a little surprised that I'm yet to see a thread on Saudi and their current presence in football, especially after the conversations pre-World Cup regarding Qatar.

I have to say, I'm finding it all a bit funny. We saw at the WC other than a few half arsed Tweets or the odd interview, nobody at the top level really seemed that bothered about any of the issues in Qatar. They'd rather a yellow card for taking their top off or arguing with a ref than supporting a cause they claim to believe in. But that was hardly surprising consider most players at the top of the game are funded by questionable American, Middle-Eastern or Russian money, become brand ambassadors for certain companies and then happy to holiday in the Dubai most years.

I'm enjoying the hypocrisy of a lot of Premier League football fans. Moan about players having their salaries quadrupled by moving there, yet didn't have an issue when they quadrupled a players salary arriving from the French or Belgian league. Worry about the potential impact of Newcastle's relationship due to their ownership model yet happy to turn a blind eye to City Group, Brighton, Watford, Chelsea or whoever else using similar transfer methods.

I think we are long past ever being able to moan about morals in elite football as they are long gone. Not only is there the financial appeal but I can see the appeal for footballers who have long enjoyed trips to Dubai as their holiday destination, for a lot of Muslim players there will be an attraction to certain parts of culture and the proximity to Southern Europe is probably quite appealing too. All these other aspects may be have been what China lacked to an extent. And clearly the regime is heavily pushing this.

I can also see this being something FIFA significantly supports due to the planned expansion of the Club World Cup and I assume their desire to make that bigger than the Champions League

Do others think what we are seeing in Saudi Arabia is here to stay or just a flash in the pan like China?

It's here to stay I fear. Although currently fabulously wealthy, the Saudis are actively reinvesting their oil wealth, via sovereign wealth funds, to give them financial security once the oil runs out (and have been actively doing so for 50 years). Sport (football and golf) will only be loose change, in terms if return on investment, compared to most of the "normal" investments. But sport has some advantages, including the much discussed "sports-washing" of the regime's reputation.

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I don't need your ill-informed, half-baked, idiotic opinions. I have plenty of those myself.

I think you've answered your own question to an extent. I don't think that many football fans care, and certainly not to the extent the media coverage would have you believe. Look at all the Newcastle fans in Saudi flags and headgear outside SJP when the takeover was confirmed. The closest they get to sportswashing is getting the pie stains out of their kit with Daz.

I firmly believe most football fans just want to see their team win, and they don't give two shits about anything else or what it takes for that to happen - even if it has major ramifications in the wider world outside the sport. This is because football has got to the point where it's the only positive or important thing in many people's lives, so why would they care about the politics of a random country they're never going to visit? It doesn't impact them directly and there isn't anything they can do to influence it.

TL;DR: "Fuck Jamal Khashoggi as long as we finish in the top four"

EDIT TO ADD: there's a social element to this as well. The PL has become the ultimate 'soap opera for men' (to quote Barry Hearn). If all your friends, colleagues and social circle talk about is football, then saying "I'm not watching it any more" - for whatever reason - is an extremely difficult thing to do.

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"I sometimes buy the Big Issue out of social embarrassment. I don't buy a fucking bank!"

Off of that, do you think viewership of the Saudi league will increase then? There will definitely be a boost, particularly from those who idolise individuals over teams. I wonder if they have a TV deal or use a streaming platform - something the PL needs to do in my eyes.

No, and there are three reasons why:

> There is already so much football on TV that there is no space to shoehorn Saudi games in at any times of day/week that will get decent ratings. Friday through Monday are chock-full of domestic games, and there's almost always something on midweek every week on (CL and EL, more league games, League Cup, FA Cup, rearranged games, international weeks). And with the bigger Club World Cup coming in, we're now almost at the point where there are tournaments every single summer. As David Mitchell said: "IT'S ALL THE FOOTBALL, ALL THE TIME!"

> People here just aren't interested in foreign league football and haven't been since Football Italia in the 90s. La Liga has had most of the world's best players outside the PL in it for a good 20 years or so now and its ratings here are terrible - that's why it bounces around different channels from one year to the next.

> Can you really see hairy-arsed blokes in factories coming into work on a Monday morning, making a cup of tea and saying "I tell you what, them Al-Ettifaq look fackin' tasty"? It might be of interest to football hipsters (like you ) but I can't see it being of interest to 'proper' working-class football fans.

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"I sometimes buy the Big Issue out of social embarrassment. I don't buy a fucking bank!"

And this is the complete opposite market as to who I'd feel they'd attract. Football hipsters will pretend to hate Saudi money whilst wearing a 90's Man Utd shirt made in a sweatshop. For me it is, for lack of a better term, 'Gen Z-ers' who would be the target market. Those who constantly use new social media, love gaming, vloggers, streamers, those old enough who love online betting. The interest may not even be in whole matches, but I can imagine the draw of highlights, kits and whatever else could be very appealing to those under 21. But I don't really know if they will be drawn in.

Hmm. Maybe. I'm not convinced because I know how socially and politically active that generation is, and how they want to be seen to be on the 'right side' of things, especially on social media.

You're absolutely right in saying that it's a completely different type of fan, though.

P.S. There's something that doesn't sound quite right about betting on Saudi Arabian football...

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"I sometimes buy the Big Issue out of social embarrassment. I don't buy a fucking bank!"

Saudi has its own sports channels, including one dedicated to the premier league, they show live PL games, as well as all the European competions, there is a big uptake in football in Saudi.

Bein Sports, which is also broadcast in English on a seperate channel, but bear in mind you have to put up with Richard Keyes and Andy Gray

As for clubs in the PL being owned by wealthy Saudi`s, i don`t think suppoters give a flying fig as long as there is some success at the club

Whilst a slightly different example but I was reading how WWE's (former WWF) viewership of weekly TV is way down on what it was in the late 90's/early 90's the fact they are the 10th most subscribed to channel on YouTube is a massive reason it remains so financially successful. New media such as TikTok, Reels, Youtube and whatever else can be massive for generating revenue, then the rise of Reaction Videos and Watch Along's on video sites further enhances popularity. There is no way those football YouTubers do not obsess over the Saudi league now - maybe even with half arsed 'moral' speeches thrown in for good measure too. Whilst the league may not be watched in the more traditional way - full games on TV - the potential for other platforms and types of view may be how it takes off.

I've seen plenty of Newcastle fans express discomfort of where their money comes from. I've also seen those particular Newcastle fans sing from the rooftops with excitement on how well they've done of late* and tbh, the only way they'd ever not be hypocritical is if the 1. Advocate what happens in Saudi or 2. Admit they're hypocrites and don't care.

*Eddie Howe did a wonderful job last year and Newcastle were fun to watch. The fans are allowed to enjoy it and it doesn't make his job any less impressive.

Years ago in Manchester before a gig I spoke to an FCUM fan - I couldn't be arsed for where the conversation would go when he found out I was an MK fan - but he actually didn't give a shit. His point was roughly "I don't care what other people do, who other people support or how they spend their money. I don't like what happened to Man Utd, I don't like what modern football has become so I follow a non League team now because I enjoy it more" and that's his prerogative.
If disgruntled Newcastle fans cared that much they'd set up FC United of Newcastle, get away from the Saudi bollocks and follow a side they can relate to. But they don't. They like that their team is finally doing well after years of shite. And fair enough. A good friend of mine is a lifelong Newcastle fan and he's enjoying it. Any time Saudi comes up it's "well, is what it is" or "We should look at ourselves in this country before we criticise others" and he's not really wrong.

Qatar was interesting. Because I know people who went out there. I also know some family friends who lives there and a few years ago tried to get me to go over and stay with them for a few weeks during the tournament. I said no because, y'know.. morals (I.e I couldn't be arsed to plan an expensive stay in a country I can't have a beer in). But everyone I've ever known who's spent time in these countries absolutely love it. It must be heaven for a Muslim footballer.

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