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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 6:35 pm 
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Yes, although I never take population into account. China are shit at cricket.

It just depends on whether there is a healthy cricket culture in the country. Remember New Zealand have rugger first, cricket second, and anything else is way behind. In England we try to do every sport, spread the nation’s natural talent more thinly, and as a result end up being mediocre at most of them.


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 8:25 pm 
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Sausage wrote:
Yes, although I never take population into account. China are shit at cricket.

It just depends on whether there is a healthy cricket culture in the country. Remember New Zealand have rugger first, cricket second, and anything else is way behind. In England we try to do every sport, spread the nation’s natural talent more thinly, and as a result end up being mediocre at most of them.

Yeah, I agree with all that. That said, I'm surprised India's massive population advantage hasn't led to an era of dominance. Cricket is number one sport there and they generate about 80 per cent of the sports revenue, as well as having a billion people. I know they struggle in away games but England, Australia and WI have had teams in the past that have been able to compete in Asian conditions, so surely India should be able to do the reverse at some point?
As an aside, does anyone know why Pakistan have a tradition of producing pace bowlers while India rarely do and generally rely on spin? Both countries are very hot, and yet the heat doesn't seem to prevent Pakistan having some strong pace attacks over the years.


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 12:01 am 
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BertieWoostersDonsClub wrote:
As an aside, does anyone know why Pakistan have a tradition of producing pace bowlers while India rarely do and generally rely on spin? Both countries are very hot, and yet the heat doesn't seem to prevent Pakistan having some strong pace attacks over the years.

A great question. It might have something to do with expectations/role models/what's gone before? So if you've produced a couple of super fast quicks, every little boy tries to bowl quick. If you have a succession of wrist and leg spinners, all the little boys want to bowl spin.

No idea if that is a factor or not, TBH...

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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 3:49 pm 
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keyser soze wrote:
BertieWoostersDonsClub wrote:
As an aside, does anyone know why Pakistan have a tradition of producing pace bowlers while India rarely do and generally rely on spin? Both countries are very hot, and yet the heat doesn't seem to prevent Pakistan having some strong pace attacks over the years.

A great question. It might have something to do with expectations/role models/what's gone before? So if you've produced a couple of super fast quicks, every little boy tries to bowl quick. If you have a succession of wrist and leg spinners, all the little boys want to bowl spin.

No idea if that is a factor or not, TBH...

Think you're probably right. Most Indians maybe aspire to be a batsman primarily (Gavaskar, Tendulkar, Kholi, etc) or a spinner; while Pakistan youngsters do have Imran Khan, Wasim, Waqar, Rawalpindi Express, etc as role models. Means there's no reason why India can't develop some fast bowlers in the future and when they do they should compete better in foreign conditions.


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:34 pm 
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Shame that Test Match has ended, I was really enjoying it. ;)
I think if it had gone on for another four days or so, it would have built up to a good finish.


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 1:41 pm 
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BertieWoostersDonsClub wrote:
Shame that Test Match has ended, I was really enjoying it. ;)
I think if it had gone on for another four days or so, it would have built up to a good finish.


Another slow and low wicket.


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:42 pm 
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Working out who England might bring in for the 5th test got me thinking about David Willey (no jokes about thinking about Willy). He's not in the squad, and has been going backwards in 4 and 5 day Cricket in last couple of years and is becoming a one-day specialist; and I think that's a real waste. All-rounders
are rare nowadays, and left-arm England bowlers are even rarer. Willey is both, and when at Northants he looked a certain Test Match all-rounder. But his move to Yorkshire seems to have stymied his development. I can understand him being behind Stokes and Woakes, but when Stokes left out of squad he still didn't get the call and now it looks like the Curran brothers are our next all-rounder hopes. At least Sam Curran is a left-armer so we may get one in the team in the near future.
But it's a shame about Willey. He's our version of Australia's James Faulkner: both really talented all-rounders who have failed to kick on. And there does seem to be a dearth of the old fashioned all-rounder in the modern game (plenty of batsmen/keepers, and batsmen/off-spinners, but not many batsmen/pace bowlers).


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 6:44 pm 
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BertieWoostersDonsClub wrote:
Working out who England might bring in for the 5th test got me thinking about David Willey (no jokes about thinking about Willy). He's not in the squad, and has been going backwards in 4 and 5 day Cricket in last couple of years and is becoming a one-day specialist; and I think that's a real waste. All-rounders
are rare nowadays, and left-arm England bowlers are even rarer. Willey is both, and when at Northants he looked a certain Test Match all-rounder. But his move to Yorkshire seems to have stymied his development. I can understand him being behind Stokes and Woakes, but when Stokes left out of squad he still didn't get the call and now it looks like the Curran brothers are our next all-rounder hopes. At least Sam Curran is a left-armer so we may get one in the team in the near future.
But it's a shame about Willey. He's our version of Australia's James Faulkner: both really talented all-rounders who have failed to kick on. And there does seem to be a dearth of the old fashioned all-rounder in the modern game (plenty of batsmen/keepers, and batsmen/off-spinners, but not many batsmen/pace bowlers).

I’m not sure there’s a dearth, possibly the opposite. We’ve rarely had two at once, it’s just unfortunate that both Stokes and Woakes missed the last test. Broad was pace bowling all-rounder too until he got hit in the helmet, so that would have been three.


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Sun Jan 07, 2018 6:53 pm 
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Sausage wrote:
BertieWoostersDonsClub wrote:
Working out who England might bring in for the 5th test got me thinking about David Willey (no jokes about thinking about Willy). He's not in the squad, and has been going backwards in 4 and 5 day Cricket in last couple of years and is becoming a one-day specialist; and I think that's a real waste. All-rounders
are rare nowadays, and left-arm England bowlers are even rarer. Willey is both, and when at Northants he looked a certain Test Match all-rounder. But his move to Yorkshire seems to have stymied his development. I can understand him being behind Stokes and Woakes, but when Stokes left out of squad he still didn't get the call and now it looks like the Curran brothers are our next all-rounder hopes. At least Sam Curran is a left-armer so we may get one in the team in the near future.
But it's a shame about Willey. He's our version of Australia's James Faulkner: both really talented all-rounders who have failed to kick on. And there does seem to be a dearth of the old fashioned all-rounder in the modern game (plenty of batsmen/keepers, and batsmen/off-spinners, but not many batsmen/pace bowlers).

I’m not sure there’s a dearth, possibly the opposite. We’ve rarely had two at once, it’s just unfortunate that both Stokes and Woakes missed the last test. Broad was pace bowling all-rounder too until he got hit in the helmet, so that would have been three.

Yeah, I agree that England are doing fine for all-rounders. When I said there's a dearth, I meant in the world game. There only seems to be England that has the traditional all-rounder in modern Test Cricket. There's a few more in one-day cricket, but not many.
All the other countries have had them in the past - Imran Khan, Rice, Hadlee, Cairns, Kallis, etc. But now it just seems to be England in Test Cricket. It's a shame as I do think a world class batsman/pace bowler all-rounder is exciting to watch.


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 Post subject: Re: Ashes Tour 2017/18
PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2018 11:23 am 
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Well the Ashes was toilet.
But it was worth getting up at 3 this morning!


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